Stark VARG

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smdub
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Stark VARG

Post by smdub »

60kw, 110kg, 6kWh, $13000 - Alta killer if they deliver (estimated delivery Sept next year)
45kw version is $1k cheaper
https://starkfuture.com/en-us-US/products/stark-varg
https://dirtbikemagazine.com/amp/new-80 ... tark-varg/

Only $100 deposit so I'll put my hat in the ring. Need to deicde on color and options...
Being a MX bike, will need a susp revalve to work well for enduro/trail ride. But its KYB so should be easy to find someone to work on it.

Last edited by smdub on Wed Dec 15, 2021 8:40 am, edited 2 times in total.
Stephen (not Steve) - '20 Husky 701LR / KTM '20 500 EXC / '17 150 XC-W / '21 E-XC / '21 890R / '19 Sherco 300FST / Sur-Ron LBX / Segway X160 / Sur-Ron Ultra Bee
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Bucho
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Re: Stark Varg

Post by Bucho »

Interesting. I hope they can deliver and are successful.

Id love to see that tech in more of a FreeRide/Xtrainer type bike.
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Firebolter
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Re: Stark Varg

Post by Firebolter »

I bet they will deliver and if it follows other "ebike" trends, the first batch will sell out and then the other models will start to come with more options and higher prices. I read multiple articles since the info release and most say the same thing, but the stuff that intrigues me is:
1. Battery design. They took the battery weight and vehicle CoG into account when they designed the shape of the battery. Battery is a stressed member of the frame.
2. They used a smart phone for the instrument. SWEET idea! It pops in and is locked in place in a nice mount. You can change all the parameters of the power delivery on the phone and change programs on the fly on the handlebar. Has Navigation that supports trail mapping etc. Think how many people do that now with smart phones and have to add mounts and power etc. You can even add a SIM card and make it a useable phone as well.
3. Virtual Flywheel. This really interest me as that just might be the start to simple and better power modulation. That is the one weakness now (I think anyway) the inability to modulate the power to the rear wheel. You have to attack more and finesse less to make harder obstacles and slippery areas etc. Ebikes apply torque on demand so you can loose the rear traction easily if you want.
4. Foot pegs are clean, lite and fold up nicely.
5. Rear axle adjuster, why didn't someone come up with that sooner? What a clean and simple idea! Clickers built in to make the adjustment simple and precise.
6. KYB suspension and Brembo brakes. Awesome, real suspension that will allow you to charge as hard as any other full size bike. And you get to choose the spring rates when you order one. Great idea-no additional charge.

This bike will smoke all the others except maybe the KTM as they are similar (full size I mean) just due to the suspension. Cake and a couple of the other high end ebikes cost about the same but have no where near the level of components or serious suspension. They all are more Downhill MTB styles of suspension and while they can take alot of abuse, I would feel better on a bike will real suspension for serious off road riding. Good stuff!
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Re: Stark Varg

Post by smdub »

Yeah, I *LOVE* the adjustment/customization it looks to allow to the ride modes. My KTM E falls short there (esp after I was spoiled w/ the Nucular 24F on the SurRon)

Its the same weight as my KTM E, 1.5x more battery. 8-18kg lighter than the Alta and 1.2x1.6x more power. Whats not to like?

I put a deposit down. 18" wheel, standard 45kW(60hp), LHRB, kickstand, white plastics (though I'm debating the red. White would look killer w/ some custom graphics)
Stephen (not Steve) - '20 Husky 701LR / KTM '20 500 EXC / '17 150 XC-W / '21 E-XC / '21 890R / '19 Sherco 300FST / Sur-Ron LBX / Segway X160 / Sur-Ron Ultra Bee
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Re: Stark VARG

Post by Firebolter »

Power-80hp
Weight-110kg / 242 lbs fully charged
Wheel torque-938 Nm
Range-Up to 6 hours
Charging time-1 to 2 hours
Battery capacity-6kWh
Suspension-310 mm travel Front/Rear KYB
Ride modes-More than 100
Adjustability-Power curve, engine braking, flywheel effect & traction control

938Nm (~698Ftlbs) IS INSANE! Now obviously that is at full power but DAMN! Acceleration should be intense to say the least. If you look at the sprockets, the sizes look comparable to a ICE 300, so if you drop that rear ~10 teeth, can you imagine the speed you might be able to get out of this thing? OMG with that kinda torque you could drive most any gearing combos.

I like the Grey one!

Image
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Re: Stark VARG

Post by smdub »

Be careful w/ the torque value. ICE are rated at the engine shaft. Electric are rated after the gearbox and sometimes the rear wheel. Not apples-apples *AT ALL*. I could make 1000Nm on a pedal bicycle w/ the appropriate gearing.

Edit: To put some comparison numbers out there: An uncorked 2020 KTM 500 makes about 50Nm at the crank. Primary gear ratio is 2.452. 1st gear is 2.571. Secondary ratio (stock 14:48 sprockets) is 3.43. Thats a total gear multiplier of 21.62. 50Nm * 21.62 = 1080Nm at the wheel. That is the apples-apples comparison. Not really that different peak.
The main advantage for electric is your are ALWAYS in the right gear AND in the meat of the powerband. This can't be emphasized enough. When I'm lugging my 500 down the road I am not at the rpm required for peak hp or torque. In an electric you are. THAT is what makes electrics feel so much more powerful. This is really apparent after riding one the first time.
I love my little 150 to death. It makes 2x the power of the SurRon. But 'just riding along' it won't wheelie over a puddle or jump a berm. If you are 'on it' and already have the motor at 8-10krpm it sure as heck will but lazy riding, not a chance. The SurRon or KTM E on the other hand... Unless you are already hauling ass speed wise, just snap the throttle and the front wheel can be in the air at will. Every time. No need to think about what gear you are in. Its addicting.
Last edited by smdub on Wed Dec 15, 2021 10:53 am, edited 5 times in total.
Stephen (not Steve) - '20 Husky 701LR / KTM '20 500 EXC / '17 150 XC-W / '21 E-XC / '21 890R / '19 Sherco 300FST / Sur-Ron LBX / Segway X160 / Sur-Ron Ultra Bee
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Re: Stark VARG

Post by Firebolter »

Exactly, rated at the rear wheel. Regardless, that much torque will be quite fun to play with but I bet alot of guys will loop these bikes in some situations until they get used to the power delivery. Hell my SurRon can be a handful if my weight is not centered when I whack it!
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Re: Stark VARG

Post by smdub »

Firebolter wrote: Wed Dec 15, 2021 10:25 am I bet alot of guys will loop these bikes
I think that happens w/ most electrics and new riders;) There is no noise to remind you there is the equivalent of a motor screaming at peak rpm that you are about to do a clutch drop on when you twist the throttle rapidly. An ICE bike audibly warns you of the imminent danger. An electric hides its potential for extreme violence. :thumbup:
Stephen (not Steve) - '20 Husky 701LR / KTM '20 500 EXC / '17 150 XC-W / '21 E-XC / '21 890R / '19 Sherco 300FST / Sur-Ron LBX / Segway X160 / Sur-Ron Ultra Bee
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Re: Stark VARG

Post by smdub »

Stark's response today on my question about the power:
the difference between the Alpha and the Standard is just the software. All the rest is the same.
Stephen (not Steve) - '20 Husky 701LR / KTM '20 500 EXC / '17 150 XC-W / '21 E-XC / '21 890R / '19 Sherco 300FST / Sur-Ron LBX / Segway X160 / Sur-Ron Ultra Bee
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Re: Stark VARG

Post by Bucho »

smdub wrote: Wed Dec 15, 2021 10:58 am
Firebolter wrote: Wed Dec 15, 2021 10:25 am I bet alot of guys will loop these bikes
I think that happens w/ most electrics and new riders;) There is no noise to remind you there is the equivalent of a motor screaming at peak rpm that you are about to do a clutch drop on when you twist the throttle rapidly. An ICE bike audibly warns you of the imminent danger. An electric hides its potential for extreme violence. :thumbup:
I had a few guys loop out on my kids stock OSET 20! And those are incredibly weak by comparison
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